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Post by Admin Mal on Jan 21, 2007 23:04:51 GMT 1
We've just watched an interesting programme tonight which will be shown again on BBC1 on Wed night 8pm, 24th January. 'Climate Change - Britain under Threat.'
David Attenborough, Kate Humble and Matt Alwright look at the results of an experiment which attempts to predict what our temperatures and weather will be like at various stages through the 21st century and how this will affect us. Worth watching.
Not sure if this is the correct thread for this, with it being headed 'Renewable Energy'. Or perhaps we should change the thread title to encompass green issues in general?
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Post by mucklelaalie on Jan 21, 2007 23:33:33 GMT 1
ooof... putting a climate change article in the renewable energy forum is almost asking for a David rant... ooof However, that would be a terrible occurrence and will not happen *keeps 'mind' guns loaded...* Anywho... I was actually wanting to watch it, just slipped my mind... been preparing a power point presentation for CCP (comparative criminal procedure...) with my presentation partner in crime (you see what I....). Hope it twas good and not journalistic scaremongering... hopefully it wasn't being a BBC/David Attenbourgh effort and all. Anywho...
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Post by maree on Jan 22, 2007 22:31:34 GMT 1
Soonds interesing Fiona....what was the outcome of the weather/temperature predictions for da future? It may soond silly, but we really need to consder these things in relation to future development.......especially things like growing food. I can mind as a babe in arms even thirty years ago the summers really WIR warmer. Hay could be cured withoot too many mishaps.....bit noo....
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Post by heimdal on Jan 23, 2007 1:24:28 GMT 1
Do we not have a selective memory, mindin on da boannie days, an da days wi sna, whin we got a day aff school ? I ken I do ;D
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Post by benjiesmum on Jan 23, 2007 6:19:25 GMT 1
Climate change is one of those subjects that is clearly at the top of everyone's agenda these days, and certainly we as humans are helping that change along at a rate of knots. But on the other hand, climate is always changing and sometimes it changes very rapidly and there are clues about this everywhere in the rocks - coal and oil where once there were warm seas and tropical forests; ice ages etc. But I suppose that was down to natural forces not carbon emissions. What worries me most is the lasting damage we seem to be doing to the planet now with these emissions and, as we in the west are getting slightly better at controlling them, other countries such as Poland, India and China are busily producing more of the stuff. Meanwhile, in the USA, George Bush keeps looking the other way and thinks the Kyoto Protocol is a new board game he might buy for Christmas. The British government is so concerned that they have slapped a new "green tax" on all holiday makers who use aircraft travel, and apparently that will make not a jot of difference, well only to line their coffers. Yesterday, and this reminds me of the thread about unnecessary packaging, I received an order for ten ink cartridges in a box that was the size of a large crisp box and each item was in a huge plastic and cardboard container instead of just a simple cardboard box. I hit the roof and will be phoning the supplier this morning. We are just such a wasteful bunch of tennants of the Earth. As a species we surely have inflicted the most damage on the planet and it seems to be continuing.
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Post by Pat on Jan 23, 2007 11:39:44 GMT 1
Do we not have a selective memory, mindin on da boannie days, an da days wi sna, whin we got a day aff school ? I ken I do ;D I think we are all guilty of selective memory at times. However, I can honestly say I have never seen the meadows on our croft as wet. And I thought the last two or three years couldn't be topped for wetness. I think there are many peerie things we can all do. I heard a man on the TV say the other day, "It's the mess we're leaving to our grandchildren I'm worried about." This really hit home to me as a grandmother.
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Post by maree on Jan 23, 2007 15:05:29 GMT 1
Do we not have a selective memory, mindin on da boannie days, an da days wi sna, whin we got a day aff school ? I ken I do ;D I think the problem was that I didn't explain myself too well, rather than a selective memory. The seasons used to be....well...... seasonal! Sun in summer, snow in winter, wind during the autumn and bulbs sprootin in spring......not december and being wiped oot by snow/frost in April/May! Weather was a peerie bit more dependable and we never lost onybody in a mudswamp in da tattie rig.
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Post by benjiesmum on Jan 23, 2007 20:59:16 GMT 1
Sadly, I think many of us here in the relatively affluent west suffer from what has been called "affluenza". Many people run gas-guzzling cars; eat foodstuffs grown far from home; throw things away without so much as a thought for the disposal issues. The sight of all those redundant fridges, freezers and computers makes me despair at times. I have to admit, I am no "green angel" but I do think long and hard now before I buy produce such as veggies and fruit. There's no way anymore I would buy, say, apples from Chile or green beans from Kenya etc. But they are nevertheless available in supermarkets. Reports from relatives across the pond talk of horrendous weather in British Columbia (blizzards and storms which are not usual on the west coast) and record highs in Ontario where they were out in shirt sleeves at Christmas (unheard of in past years). They are listening to our weather reports with great interest, but are experiencing bizzare weather changes of their own. And yes, when you think what a terrible mess this planet will be left in for future generations it really is about time that this problem was taken reallyseriously by all governments without the option to "opt out." Furthermore, when you consider that this really serious damage has only been inflicted on the planet since the late18th, early 19th century - such a short time in the planet's history. Oh dear! Let's all try harder. Any "green tips" anyone?
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Post by mucklelaalie on Jan 23, 2007 21:20:40 GMT 1
Furthermore, when you consider that this really serious damage has only been inflicted on the planet since the late18th, early 19th century - such a short time in the planet's history. Not sure its possible to know how much damage has been inflicted since the late 18th centure onwards... climate is changing, human activity contributing, but variations of a large nature have come and gone before 'us' and will do after 'us' (not that I deny human activity playing a part, probably a large part in the rate of acceleration of any change!) It would be good if all Govt's took it seriously... yes... but thats for public opinion to force, nobody else is going to. I'd severely doubt the human race are unselfish enough to recognise, as a majority, that they need to act differently. A lot of the success of the human race was its ability to be selfish and exploit, with consideration only to persons they were closely connected with... which probably fuelled the selfish behaviour further, still does i'd guess. Until something catastrophic is right on the doorstep, the majority are not going to do anything. A vocal and somewhat large minority might be heard... but not sure thats going to get the job done. Humans are reactionary... always were and always (well for the foreseeable future until we develop into some kind of uber human) will be... instincts over reason... in some respects as 'silly' an animal as many others. Being that 'environmental law' is one of my three honours subjects this year... unsuprisingly the whole climate change thing has come up. Kyoto isn't as good as its cracked up to be... not least because of exemptions it has afforded to countries like China (a new power station every week of the year). The effectiveness of its mechanisms (mostly market driven incentives) are somewhat doubtful. However... if Kyoto was fully implemented then it would be a big start at least! Not that the targets it has set are really sufficient. I'll leave my logical argument of why it really shouldn't be a concern of humans at all out of the forum... keep the powder dry for the exam! Not that this is the conclusion i'm sure many would like to arrive at (not saying i necessarily believe in it). But I don't think I can take much more of the media whoring ('warmest year since 197something' "we're doomed"... always makes me wonder how that year in 197something was warmer... hmmm) (NOT that i'm saying i don't believe that could be an indication of trends, trends of which we can't begin to properly estimate though!) (NOT that i'm saying i don't believe that trends indicate a substantial warming!). *wonders if he's placed enough defences in post to avoid backlash* anywho
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Post by Pat on Jan 23, 2007 21:47:38 GMT 1
I'll leave my logical argument of why it really shouldn't be a concern of humans at all out of the forum... keep the powder dry for the exam! Now I really am curious What could this mean I am thinking total blackout due to super volcano here.
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Post by mrgluss on Jan 23, 2007 22:15:20 GMT 1
I'm sure Nortower understands the legal arguments for Kyoto or otherwise - I certainly don't. What I do know is that the resources in the world are ill-parted and climate-change or not, there are things I can do that make me feel better and reduces my carbon footprint. For instance, if I buy Kenyan beans and Peruvian asparagus they will have lost a lot of their nutritional value by the time I eat them. They will also have consumed a lot of hydrocarbons to arrive on my table. So I don't buy them any more, and try instead to eat British produce - less airmiles, more nutrition. I also try to buy organic - less hydrocarbons consumed (artificial fertiliser) and better for the ground (even if the health benefits to me aren't conclusively proven). And then there's fair trade - surely we all get a bit of a glow from spending an extra 50p on teabags when you know the teapickers have a better life (I've seen teapickers in Sri Lanka, and their lives were pretty miserable). So I say be entirely selfish and do this stuff to make yourself feel better! , even if it does bugger all for the planet. Some may say this is p***ing in the wind, but until we all get really frightened about the famines, wars, plagues etc which I believe are on their way as the climate changes, not a lot is likely to happen. Doom gloom etc. (I'll shut up now - thank you for listening).
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Post by mucklelaalie on Jan 23, 2007 22:21:51 GMT 1
Beware of the Dutch... well, if they have any ground to build anything on for their vengeful retaliation... ;D
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Post by Pat on Jan 23, 2007 22:23:33 GMT 1
To take your arguement further mrgluss - and I know you advocate growing things yourself - it would be so much better if we produced much of the stuff ourselves. There is nothing better than totally fresh new Shetland tatties, neeps, onions etc. That way you can cut down on waste by composting, cut down on transport and have all the taste and goodness as well. OK, Ok a bit pie in the sky - or is it...
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Post by Admin Mal on Jan 23, 2007 22:46:58 GMT 1
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Post by benjiesmum on Jan 24, 2007 8:00:29 GMT 1
Beware of the Dutch... well, if they have any ground to build anything on for their vengeful retaliation... ;D Why! What have the Dutch done - apart from irradiate tomatoes, produce veal in a totally unacceptable way and slaughter millions of birds at the last Avian Flu scare. and that's on a good day!!! Nice canal system though, that they still use effectively. Not being sarky, NortOwer, I just must have had my head in the teapot when the Dutch started misbehavin! It's going to bed so early, you see, I miss an awful lot! ;D And mrgluss, I'm with you on the organic front - I don't want to eat pesticide residue and all the other revolting chemicals they spray on crops, nor do I want to eat beef with additional hormones or chicken that has been battery farmed - if you really want to get me going - there's a subject! Do you know that in order to make sure a carrot has no residues in it, you have to peel off about quarter of an inch of skin?
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